The model 19s also have a smaller profile forcing cone with a flat. While a cavernous forcing cone is forgiving of sloppy timing and loose cylinder lockup in a worn out gun, it is not ideal for best target accuracy. Results would likely be best with jacketed bullets. How is a cartridge in a revolver perfectly aligned with the inlet of the. Another issue is the smoothness or roughness of the forcing cone. When i inspected the forcing cone up close, i found out why. If youre interested in how this happened, then please read below. Jframe 38357 revolvers hold 5 shots while kframes in hold six. The crack in the pictured forcing cone demands a barrel. Indicate the barrel on both axis and then make the cuts. I have a model 193 that shows little wear i only fire 38 spl and 158 gr.
Such larger bullets will swage down in the forcing cone of the barrel and within the limits of the bullet alloy, shoot accurately and will not lead. Highest quality gunsmith tools, including revolver forcing cone cutters at pacific tool and gauge. Here are a couple of pics of the barrel on my super blackhawk. Revolver deburring tool includes cutter and handle. The barrel was pretty obviously cracked when i got it. The cracked forcing cone problem was very limited in numbers, but it did happen. It did a amazing job and improved the guns accuracy especially with lead bullets. But in reality it presents no problem in terms of practical field utility. Yes if a person does not clean the forcing cone properly. So, what you need to do first is to slug your barrel to determine its bore size and then slug each of. Forcing cone tools rentals archives 4d reamer rentals. For some reason, it cracked more stainless forcing cones than blued. If the revolver spits or leads, or seems to have accuracy problems then maybe something should be done.
I had a gp100 that did the same thing, and now a super blackhawk. Ive heard the same about not using the lighter weight, higher velocity rounds in the model 19 for the same reasons forcing cone cracking. I tried my best to capture what i am talking about in some decent pictures. It should be repairable under warranty, but it is rather old for that. I am the original owner of this pistol, having been given to me in high school about 1982, its a model 194. The alignment of parts in a revolver is called timing. With the taylor system, the bullet is completely suppported and centered as it enters the rifling leade. Granted, the flat spot on my revolver is not as dramatic, its still a concern.
The k frame magnums have a flat section of the forcing cone that is prone to cracking with the use of hypervelocity lightweight 357 magnum ammo such as 110 or 125 grain. Revolver forcing cone tools 44 caliber 11 degree includes the 11 degree forcing cone cutter, rod, thandle and bushing where needed. If the forcing cone is cracked, the barrel is cracked because the forcing cone is cast with the barrel. Cracked ruger super blackhawk barrel gunboards dot com. Now i can literally vary almost all of the above and get great accuracy with everything and no leading with anything. The forcing cone is the face of the barrel inside the frame, and will crack or erode more quickly as. Cracked forcing cone page 2 the firearms forum the. Mine works like a clockwork, but problem occured in his gun after shooting about 1700 rounds of regular, factory ammo 158gr forcing cone cracked. Hello i have heard that too, but i have heard that the forcing cones can be cracked by using the 125 grain hollow point bullets on the model 19s due to the lighter weight of the bullet it slams into the forcing cone with such force that it actually mushrooms the slug before entering the internal bore.
He said that he should have checked it out better when it came in because that model was notorious for cracked forcing cones. When introduced, the kframe revolvers, due to their many desirable. This results in a cosmetic damage on the bottom part of a revolvers top strap that gets more and more visible with continued shots. The lead deposits can cause thot spots which can result in a cracked forcing cone. First off i am sorry that your 19 developed a crack in the forcing cone.
If that was it, this would be a good pistol right there. Ive got the right oil from brownells and their kit but after an hour it dont look like ive been working on it at all and i. Are cracked forcing cones the result of shooting high rounds counts of full power light grain ammo. For example, could you shoot hot 125gr 357 mag loads in a model 619 l frame or a model 28 n frame, or hot 185gr 44 mag loads in a model. Whenever a loaded revolvers trigger is pulled, the expanding hot gases that push the bullet out of the cylinder with velocity and into the revolvers forcing cone escapes through the cylinder gap. Cleaning my 6 stainless gp100 a few days ago and noticed that the forcing cone was cracked. Another centerfire revolver, another cracked forcing cone. The expansion of the forcing cone is so bad the barrel cannot be removed without cutting off the forcing cone in the cylinder window, which is going to be a huge pain in the butt. Until the introduction of this kit, tools of this type were almost impossible to obtain commercially, and even the most proficient pistolsmiths seldom had chamfering tools of such excellent design and high quality for use in the modern revolver. It handles fast, shoots faster and puts powerful rounds in tiny spaces far away. Do know that many of the older revolvers that onwers have brought to me as blown had a cracked forning cone and were out of time. As much as i like my model 19s and they are 357 magnums i dont shoot 357 magnums much at all. Nice clean barrel with a bad crack that renders it useless without careful gunsmith rework.
I have read up on the forcing cone cracking issue, but am not sure what to. Some gunsmiths will attempt to save a barrel with a cracked forcing cone by setting the barrel back, but this almost always fails, and the crack continues to spread forward. Looking at it close, it doesnt look like the line continues on either the external or internal side of the barrel. Wed all like glossy forcing cones, but the truth is it doesnt matter much especially in a snubby. Rebarreling a revolver is not a job a job for the kitchen table. I have a 66 that i polished the cone in the 90s, it still hasnt cracked and. There is no doubt in my mind that as great as the k frame magnum is the one weakness is the flat spot at the 6 a clock position.
Dont know if a rn bullet really delivers less stress to a missaligned forcing cone or if it just delivers that stress a little farther forward which is ok as the rocing cone tapers and is thicker farther forward. My beloved sw model 19 357 developed a cracked forcing cone yesterday. Heres a brief description of how a revolver barrel is changed correctly. Also i believe the cracked forcing cones are from high round counts through revolvers and again lack of cleaning them. Split forcing cones are very common in victory models if they continued to be shot after they have gone out of time and had not been repaired. Cutting the forcing cone revolver forum brian enoss. From what your indicating i think this is do to round count. Too many magnums in a 19 would split barrels at the forcing cone and deform cranes.
I wanted to show someone in a firearms forum why the cylinder in a revolver can have slight play. A lot of this could be the lack of cleaning deposits off the forcing cone. Youll probably find one where somebody replaced their barrel with a different length one and they kept the original barrel. I am not so sure i can discern any difference in accuracy between the 18 and 11 degree cones in. I have got, and shot a lot of ks, but have never seen one. The forcing cone is a very critical and sensitive area that greatly affects accuracy and. Use on the chamber throat to help rounds drop in easily. Doing some more digging, it seems that all of the recent sp101s have this flat spot, and there are some reports of cracked forcing cones to go along with it. This is a discussion on cracked forcing cone on gp100. The only proof is firing the revolver, but theres nothing wrong with the forcing cone in the photo.
Now i am spoiled and would have a hard time not rebarreling every additional revolver i might buy. As i understand it the issue has less to do with the speed or weight of the bullet and everything to do with its length. The only way to fix a cracked forcing cone is to replace the barrel. The revolver was chambered in 38 special, and would not chamber a 357 magnum.
Then i sent it off to a revolver smith for a douglas barrel. The forcing cone split top and bottom, and there is absolutely no way the loads that i was shooting would do this. Forcing cone erosion using a steady diet of hot 357 magnum loads using a 125gr or lighter bullet isnt just limited to the smith k frames. Does anybody have a good picture of the elusive cracked forcing cone of a kframe. Revolver forcing cone cutters pacific tool and gauge. The forcing cone allows for slight misalignment, it funnels the bullet into the rifling. That forcing cone minus the obvious crack shows the results of a steady diet of magnum loaded rounds. Im having the hardest time getting it to cut the barrel. One of the weaknesses in the kframe is in the cut on the bottom of the barrel throat, in the forcing cone area, to accommodate the cylinder swing. Eliminates lead shaving or spitting in one or two passes. The ww2era 158grain fmj military round was loaded to higher pressure than common police service 158grain lrn of that era, in order to maintain standard velocity given the increased bore drag of the jacketed bullet. In summary, the issue with the k frame magnums is not the width of the barrel. Cracked forcing cone the firearms forum the buying. I am not so sure about the 5 degree forcing cones as i have never measured the few.
Cracks usually occurred at the forcing cones 6 oclock position. This whole thing about modifying forcing cones is all about how gradual a taper this funnel should be. Are cracked forcing cones the result of poor maintenance on revolvers. They are marked 11 degree, but they are twice as steep as the brownells 11 degree cutter. Now, i heard that after enough magnum loads the forcing cone cracks and that other parts of the revolver begin to wear out. When it finally cracked the forcing cone, he sent it in. In the attached photo you can see the flat region on the bottom of the barrel throat. The gun is about three years old and has about 600 round through it. I personally know of a ruger blackhawk that had a steady diet of those hot lots, its on its 3rd barrel.
There may be a kernel of truth to what the smith says but im convinced that the internet has blown any cracked forcing cone issues way out of proportion in recent years. The standard forcing cone starts to disrupt and upset the projectile before it is even out of the chamber. I do not have any forcing cone damage on my revolvers that look like that and i have owned them for many years and shot s of full power rounds through them. Includes the 22 degree forcing cone cutter, rod, thandle and bushing where needed. They had some split forcing cones when the police started using the 110gr cartridges. Ruger completely overhauled it, not just a barrel change. The forcing cone looked like it had been worked on with a cutting torch, besides the crack. The 125grainers were very efficient on the street but very hard on. I found out about the crack when i noticed that the front sight kept moving around and thought that the barrel was loose and saw it when checking the gun over.